How to find your soul's role in the spiritual war - Bernhard Guenther
Episode 566, released 1st October 2026.
Lian and psycho-spiritual researcher Bernhard Guenther explore how spiritual warfare plays out in each person's life, why purpose shifts over a lifetime, and how to tell a wounded inner part from an outside force.
Listen or watch on:
Or if you prefer to read: Scroll right down for the transcript
Bernhard Guenther is a psycho-spiritual researcher, teacher, and guide whose work explores the deeper architecture of reality and the evolutionary challenges humanity faces during this Time of Transition.
Drawing on over two decades of study, practice, and inner work, he integrates esoteric wisdom, depth psychology, trauma healing, shadow integration, and a clear understanding of the spiritual and hyperdimensional forces that influence human consciousness.
He is the founder of Piercing the Veil of Reality and co-host of The Cosmic Matrix podcast with his wife, Laura Matsue Guenther. Through online courses, mentoring, articles, podcasts, and retreats, he helps sincere seekers cultivate discernment, embody their true nature, and align with their deeper purpose in a time of profound change.
In this episode, Lian and Bernhard return to spiritual warfare for a second conversation, this time bringing it home to the individual soul and what each person might be called to. Bernhard shares how he came to the US in his twenties certain he'd be a drummer, practising eight hours a day and visualising success, and how none of it worked out, until a roommate introduced him to bodywork and he found a healing gift in his hands.
They talk about dharma as something fluid, lived as fully by a plumber who loves his craft as by anyone teaching spirituality, and look at why people fixated on fighting outer darkness can leave their own shadow untended... mistaking an abandoned inner child for an entity attachment, or sliding into grandiosity once they identify with the warrior archetype.
Listen if you've wondered what your role is in the spiritual war, whether your purpose has to be something grand and overtly spiritual, or how to know if it's an entity or a part of you that’s creating thoughts and feelings.
We’d love to know what YOU think about this week’s show. Let’s carry on the conversation… please leave a comment below.
What you’ll learn from this episode:
Why the pull to feel chosen, special, or already awake is one of the most dangerous traps on the spiritual path
How to tell a wounded inner part from something that has come in from outside
Why focusing on dark forces can draw them closer, but why ignoring them leaves you more exposed
Resources and stuff that we spoke about:
Join UNIO, The Fellowship for Wild Sovereign Souls: This is for the old souls in this new world… Discover your kin & unite with your soul’s calling to truly live your myth.
Don’t want to miss a thing?
Subscribe (BTW, it’s absolutely FREE) to the show on your favourite platform or app by clicking the relevant button below… That way you’ll receive each episode automagically straight to your device as soon as it’s released!
Thank you!
Lian & Jonathan
Episode Transcript:
Please note: We are a small team and not able to check through the transcript our software provides. So you may find some words are out of place and a few sentences don’t make complete sense. If you do see something utterly ridiculous we’d love you to let us know so we can correct it. Please email any howlers with the time stamp to team@wildsovereignsoul.com.
Lian (00:00)
What part might each of us be playing in the spiritual war, even when our lives and work might look quite ordinary? This week I'm joined once again by psycho-spiritual researcher Bernhard Gunther to explore how spiritual warfare plays out in each person's life, why purpose might shift over a lifetime, and how to tell a wounded inner part from an outside force.
Bernhard is the founder of Piercing the Veil of Reality and the co host of the Cosmic Matrix podcast, drawing on over two decades of esoteric study, depth psychology, and shadow integration. We return to the topic of spiritual warfare for a second conversation, this time bringing it home to the individual soul and what each person might be called to. Bernhard shares how he came to the US in his twenties. Certain he'd be a drummer, practising eight hours a day and visualising success, and how none of it quite worked out, until a roommate introduced him to bodywork and he found a healing gift in his hands. We talk about Dharma as something that isn't perhaps as grandiose or as fixed as we might think. It could be lived fully by a plumber who loves his craft as by anyone teaching spirituality.
And we look at why people fixated on fighting outer darkness can leave their own shadow untended, mistaking an abandoned inner child for an entity attachment or sliding into grandiosity once they identify with this archetype of being a spiritual warrior.
So listen if you've ever wondered what your role is in the spiritual war. Whether your purpose has to be something grand and overtly spiritual, or how to know if it's an entity or a part of you that's creating thoughts and feelings. If you're new here, this is a show about the deeper, truer life, the one your soul is calling you towards. If you've been here before, you already know that. And that calling is exactly why Unio exists. Unio is the fellowship of wild sovereign souls.
Where Jonathan and I twice each month meet with members in our guidance circle to meet you in whatever is alive in your life. And it really is whatever. It could be your relationships, your health, your soul path, the places you feel challenged or called, or both. Often they show up at the same time. And we bring everything we are and everything we know to meet you exactly where you are and to help you move forward.
You can find out more and join us at wildsovereignsoul.com/unio And now back to this week's episode. Let's dive in.
Lian (02:58)
Hello, Bernhard. Welcome back to the show.
Bernhard Guenther (03:01)
Hello. Thanks for having me back. Looking forward to it.
Lian (03:05)
Oh my pleasure. And as we were just saying, this very much is a part two to our first episode about spiritual warfare. And we're now moving into what that might look like for each of us as individuals, as souls incarnated here in these times and what it is that we might be called to. So I'm really looking forward to getting into that. But let's first for, I mean, Again, I'd very much suggest if you're listening to this and haven't listened to that first episode with Bernhard and I go back and listen to that. But for anyone who perhaps has listened to it and it's a month or two ago, let's start with a little bit of a foundation as to what we even talking about in terms of spiritual warfare as much as appreciate. It's a huge topic, but if you can just give a little bit of a...
our primer before we dive into what this looks like at an individual soul level.
Bernhard Guenther (04:08)
Yeah, so spiritual warfare sounds like two big words, very intense, almost like a Hollywood meme movie or some sort of battle, right? people visualise. But what may some people maybe don't know when you study the spiritual traditions, the Turk traditions, even the Bhagavad Gita, you go to the Vedas or even Western esotericism, you understand then once you on the path towards awakening, the path itself becomes a battle, right? And Twofold, you're also encountering spiritual forces that are not interested in your awakening to say the least. They want to keep you asleep for their own purpose and agenda, right? So they are in your way the adversaries, so to speak, called in many traditions, different names in the Gnostics. The Archons, the Jing in the Sufi tradition, or the Azuras, Rashakas, Pisachas in the Hindu tradition, or the demons and Satan.
You know, Christian traditions and all these are different types of spiritual beings that also interfere with on the path towards awakening. So there's one level, but it's also a battle, as it's known and understood in the Zatiac traditions within ourselves to you can even see it from a psycho-spiritual perspective or psychological perspective to fight your inner demon so to speak, your inner parts, the ego that resists, the inner child that kind of has a tant tantrum fit. You know what I mean? Like you have children, you know what I mean? Similarly, you deal with your own inner children that don't like to do the work, that don't want to sit in meditation, that'd rather binge out and whatnot, right? So there's an inner discipline. So that inner work takes the form of a battle, right? For anybody who's really sincere in the inner work, understand that's a battle, right?
And then some people say nowadays, who maybe let's say, for lack of better words, very influenced by a flatland pop spiritual new age idea of spiritual work that we shouldn't use words like war and battle and we make it hard on ourselves, right? But with all due respect, that's mostly coming from people who have never truly engaged in that inner work and understand what it's all about. And I'm not implying that we should just like it's not about having like a violent, aggressive attitude, but understanding that you need some sort of attitude of a spiritual warrior, as it's written in the one of the most profound teachings, spiritual teachings, the Bhagavad Gita, Arjuna on the battlefield, which is almost like a symbolism for his own inner world, right? And we need to really become aware of what I need to slay, slaying the dragon, so to speak. It's also you see it in in Western mysticism, in our King Arthur legends and the dragon legends, like slaying the dragon is also about the inner work, so to speak. and
Really understanding what do I need to integrate as part of myself, what do I need to reject? so and also in this day and age, when we do spiritual work or psychological work, I talked about this in the last interview. When we do psychological work, we understand our inner world, you know, in terms of even on the basic level, the ego, what is the shadow from Jungian perspective. I need to integrate the inner children, inner child, traumatised child, you know what I mean. We all have our inner children, we identify with or they come forth when they get triggered and we mistake it for the true self and how to handle that. Or anima animas, the inner male and inner feminine, within a man and a woman, right? How to integrate those parts and all that. So we have a map of the psychic. But what a lot of people don't understand when they gauge in into spiritual work. What I mean by spiritual work, even prayer, meditation, even some people working with medicine plans or what in whatever way you open yourself up to spiritual realms, you need to be very discerning and have a map of the spiritual realm. because it is known, as I said, it all as it complete as a tech additions. They don't only show you the way out, so to speak, towards awakening, embodiment, but also the forces that are in the way that trick you. That, you know, and it's not always that obvious like in a Hollywood movie, like a demonic entity attacks you, but they work through temptations for, you know, getting off the false path or false teachings or the appeal to your ego, to your weaknesses, trying to get you off your path. So it's un important to understand divine laws or cult laws, how these forces interact, how they're kind of trying to deceive you and separate basically positive forces from good from benevolent forces. And most often also understanding that negative forces can appear as divine forces, as it's known to all the Zat traditions. And that's very big issue, especially in the resurgence of the new age. Lots of people channeling alien beings, all kinds of s you know, the galactic federation of light and people are not very discerning within what they're calling in, who they what they get themselves involved in. And that can have detrimental effects in their own inner development. Especially the luciferic temptation, what Rudolf Steiner talked about, the kind of Lucifer, Luciferic beings instill in you that You're already awake. You're better than others. You're superior than others. You're very special. You have a special mission. You're a starseed. You're a light worker, right? So they appeal to the wounded ego to make you feel better than others or special and all of that. And that's that's one of the most devastating traps because as Gurdjieff would say, you are you believe yourself to be awake, but you have actually fallen more into disillusionment and illusion and
Lian (09:39)
Hmm.
Bernhard Guenther (09:40)
overestimate your level of being, which is A more devastating trap than somebody who is asleep and is not pretending to be awake. Right. So the biggest issue is also known in all the traditions, as when the ego becomes spiritualized. That's the essence of spiritual bypassing and all of that. So why that's why this whole inner work, this awakening process takes the form of a battle, you know? Sri Yurbindu, many others, avatars, even Rudolf Steiner talked about this in in these terms.
And that's just the way it is. And in the sense and so we need to un understand what the virtues or the characteristics of a spiritual warrior are, right? To take full self responsibility, to engage in this inner work with a certain stoicism as well. And most importantly, understanding the forces we are subject ourselves to.
Lian (10:32)
Mm. Wonderful. Thank you. That's a great, there's so many pathways from what you've just shared. The first thing that I'd love to look at is you mentioned there, the, notion of I'm very special. I'm a star seed. I'm a light worker. And certainly And this can come in different forms. I've spent many years in, for example, more shamanic circles. So it might be different languaging, but this idea of, know, I've got this particular, you know, help or guide that I work with, which again, may or may not be true or even beneficial. and so taking what you've said there, put very simply, one might say, to even be consciously on a spiritual path, a soul path, one is already kind of taking part in this spiritual war, that requires
Bernhard Guenther (11:40)
Correct.
Lian (11:41)
that. And whilst there is that, let's say pitfall of seeing oneself as like, I'm here to do battle on behalf of humanity.
Bernhard Guenther (11:54)
Yeah, that's already the ego coming in right there.
Lian (11:56)
Yes, and so one interested in looking at is, do you see there's something, let's say more nuanced, where our own work is in kind of that work that you described that is required for one on a spiritual path to be conscious of this spiritual warfare, how that's playing out within our own self and our path, and How might that, without again going into this kind of ego version of it, like I'm here to do battle on behalf of all humanity, how might our own personal role within that spiritual battle, how might that be affecting more than us, affecting the whole, or even just affecting those around us?
How do you see that, again, without kind of attaching these like big ideas and ego to it, how might there naturally be a way in which we are kind of part on a kind of not just this kind of, mean, ultimately no man is an island. So there is that, but I'd love to hear a little bit more detail from you as to how you see our role kind of goes beyond just our own path.
Bernhard Guenther (13:24)
Yeah, so at some point it's just to be clear, you know, when I speak out, you know, the trap is specialness feeling better than others, and then people say we're all special, we're all individuals. Like I'm not there's a difference between the ego hijacking the process and trying to separate itself from it and own think it's all doing it right, like taking ownership for what actually is the divine's work, so to speak.
Because on higher levels of consciousness, you truly have an inner experience that the ego is just an instrument. You just become you are an instrument for the higher force, which then uniquely expresses through you. So there's uniqueness, absolutely. We all have specific you can even see there's truth in the idea of like special meshions or you know, star seeds and whatnot. The point is just hijacking it and identifying with it. So just to put this into context, we all have something unique to contribute.
Right, as you as a unique expression of the divine, so to speak. So there's you know, you have special special lessons to learn, karmic lessons, soul lessons, and also s certain special gifts and talents you have which are unique to you, which nobody else has and can do. You know what I mean? So we all have something unique to contribute. I want to really point that out.
But this is also ties into the process of individuation based on Carl Jung's work to become more individuated, which is not to be mistaken, what culture calls an individual. Right? An individual is still like more the ego identification. So individuated is being more like becoming more an instrument for the self with capital S, which expresses itself uniquely through you. And then, you know, Sriobindo was really clear about this in this integral yoga. it is not about escaping the world.
You know, this is whole the issue, like people like do this work, they want to escape the samsara or the reincarnation circle. It's not at some point you realise, quote unquote, you, if you're sincere in your inner work, that it's not about you anymore. Because your being has expanded itself through the inner work, and you come inevitably to the realisation, to the truth that everything is connected, everything is interrelated. No man is an island, nothing is isolated.
So naturally you realise embodiedly that your own inner work, the more you purify yourself, the more you come in alignment with the divine force that wants to work uniquely through you, the more it affects the world. Right?
Lian (15:49)
Mmm.
Bernhard Guenther (15:50)
Through that. So everything is interrelated. That's also why he said it, you know, you start to take on the burden of the world naturally, because you everything is connected. So you have more power onto the world through that work.
And even David Hawkins showed in his map of consciousness that one person on higher levels of consciousness cancels cancels out the negativity and ignorance of millions of people on lower levels of consciousness because of your whole being has expanded and you then naturally wage battle, as Sri Yobindhu said, on a collective level as well, because your being has enlarged. So
Lian (16:29)
Hmm.
Bernhard Guenther (16:29)
And that's also the whole, I would say, the deeper meaning even in the Buddhist tradition of the bodhisattva, right? Who comes back, even though has found the bodhisattva, has already found quote unquote personal liberation and enlightenment, but understanding, you know, or realising or experiencing the oneness of all comes back just to be of service and help others to awaken as well. So that kind of through the inner work, if you're sincere in it, you naturally will affect the collective or humanity on a positive level.
Lian (17:04)
Hmm. Yes, that really makes sense. The, what I've noticed, myself and also in the work that we do with others is there's a point at which our, our own work and our own path, as you said earlier, the, lessons that we came here in this lifetime to learn, often then starts to call us into somewhere other expressing that into the world to serve others in some more active way. So you talk there about there is a almost like organic way that our being our consciousness ripples out. And then there is this way in which we recognise, this is what I'm called to do. This is the work I'm called to do.
So there's a couple of questions. I'd love to hear your sense on the first is for you personally, at what point was that a sense of, my own work and path is now calling me to teach this, to guide others in this. What did that look like for you? Because I think this is an interesting thing. There is again, not everyone is called to teach, to guide others, but some of us are. and I don't think my sense is you're not saying that they're the only people who are, you know, called to be, playing a part in this spiritual warfare. but there is a particular way in which some of us are called in that way. Why is that? What did that look like for you?
Bernhard Guenther (18:51)
Yeah. Exact that's that's a great question. First of all
Lian (18:53)
I'll save the other question. I'll see what you say to this first. There was a two part, but we'll leave that.
Bernhard Guenther (18:56)
Yeah, but you know, I can see I can see my own life. There's a saying, tell God your plans and he will laugh at you. Right. I had many plans coming from the US. I shared this, I think, maybe in the f in the first our first session. When I came to the US in my early twenties, I had the vision I'm gonna be a drummer musician. This is my life path, this is what I'm going to do, this is my purpose. fully identified
Lian (19:21)
Mm-hmm.
Bernhard Guenther (19:22)
with it. You couldn't convince me of everything else. I was even that delusion like if I don't make it by age 27, 28, like all these other rock stars, Kurt Cobain, I'm gonna kill myself, whatever. That's it. That's all I want to do. Right. very adolescent, naive. And but I also put a lot of effort into it. Like I, you know, worked my, you know, I practiced drums every day, eight hours, played my band, had my band, we toured around. I did all back then, even in the nineties, I got into when The secret first came out, Abraham Hicks, law of attraction, aligning my thoughts, emotions. I got into Tony Robbins, visualising you know, my goals and like trying to manifest and all of that. Boom, all of it did not work because God had different had a different plan for me. You know, that's why I'm also very critical of this whole manifestation business, right? If it that's not aligned with who you truly are on a deeper soul levels with your deeper soul purpose, it's not gonna happen. As a
Lian (20:18)
Mm.
Bernhard Guenther (20:18)
Matter of fact, I don't want get into that as well. You can easily fall into black magic and get all into kinds of traps of agreements with with with dark forces and hostile forces who gladly help you manifest whatever you desire, but there's a price to be paid, like Faust paid, the Faust impact with the devil, so to
Lian (20:35)
Hmm.
Bernhard Guenther (20:36)
speak. Right. But in my instance, none of that worked. And I was you know, my band disintegrated, but all of a sudden, while I was In my mid twenties, I found I had this mentor appear, like was my roommate. He introduced me to body work, yoga, and all of this. I had a found a healing gift in my hands I didn't even know I had. People came to me to want to be worked on. Energy work, body work, physical massage, all of this. So I had a natural inclination for that. And then after the band broke up, okay, like I'm not I'm gonna do this now because I've you know I enjoy doing it, it comes easy to me. I have a talent for that, but I still had to work on it. I went through many to massage course, learned very different modalities, worked on a lot of people and had my own all of a sudden my own body work practice for 15 years, right? So that's kind of like led me. And then all of a sudden people started opening up while I was working on them and they seek guidance. So it became more like almost therapy, psycho-spiritual work already doing with people. At the same time, I started questioning everything and dealing with my own suffering. So I learned more about psychology, spirituality, you know. So naturally, all of a sudden I started doing this and then I decided that was early 2000s, you know, when just maybe MySpace happened and all these older, you know, before Facebook and all that. I started like, I you know, I wanted to talk to others about these topics I'm interested in. So and I started writing just because it helped me to also formulate my thoughts and understand what I was reading. I started writing and just, you know, put it out on MySpace so people can, you know, vibe with it. And then a friend of mine told me, Hey Benna, why don't you get a blog? And I I didn't even know what is a blog. I don't even know what that is. So I got back then one of those free WordPress blogs. That's how I started writing, right? And look at back more things, you know what I mean? That's like, you know, I was never a good writer. I just it just came automatically. It just something inspired me to do it. I didn't had no context. Now, now like there was maybe my sp some higher guidance to to motivate me, to inspire me to do that, but I had no agenda.
I did not plan to do what I'm doing now. I did not, you know, plan to do courses or teach or go in even to psychospiritual coaching or all of this. It was never a career choice, right? I think that's what I see nowadays with the social media. Everybody all of a sudden now at in in their twenties or thirties all went, I'm gonna be a coach now. I want to do this and that. I didn't think about making money with this in my f until my 40s, like after I was already 20 years into that, right? And had still my body work practice and all. And it all Came natural, right? and now all of a sudden, you know, and then I met my wife who started doing this work together and we started doing courses, our podcast. So it all happened organically, naturally, but I didn't quote unquote consciously plan on it. I was just answering the call. So, you know, was there was an inner drive, there was an inner call. So I was always going by what Joseph Campbell would call follow your bliss, right? And
Lian (23:35)
Hmm.
Bernhard Guenther (23:36)
what is bliss? Bliss is not necessarily always like what, you know. Gives you it's just something that drives you, which you like can't help doing, you know, which you would do no matter what, even if you would not get any money for it, so to speak. Right. So there's
Lian (23:49)
Hmm.
Bernhard Guenther (23:50)
a deeper drive for that. And then I still had to work on it and I still, you know, put myself out. And then I had to learn also actually a little bit the material side, the business side, because I had a whole negative view about money and income and like spiritual work should be free. And then I
was taken advantage of and this these kind of things, right? And I was just giving away too much. And and I had to then learn about exchange, right? Like, you know, so how can I do this work even in in more integrity and deeper, while also being able to live off of that so I can, you know, expand and all of this. So it was a whole learning process to really combine the spiritual world with the material aspect with just everyday living. but this quote unquote purpose is not
What I realized in my own life, it's a process. It's not an identification, right? The ego likes to think, my purpose is this and that. It's not a career, right? It's not your purpose is not a specific thing you do. It's not an identification, right? It's not like, I'm a writer, I'm a podcaster, or I'm an artist. These are just labels, right? So the higher purpose, you know, can manifest in many different ways, even now.
As I'm doing this now, who knows what happens in two, three years, five years and what I may do. That's what life taught me. Right
Lian (25:05)
Hmm.
Bernhard Guenther (25:06)
now I'm doing this. And I'm trying to not identify with it. That's why I learned a lot from the Bhagavad Gita, like to become the best instrument I can be. So it's not about quote unquote my work, right? I have certain gifts, right? I'm also not I shared this last time, I'm not reinventing the wheel. I'm not having any special knowledge or codes to download and sell you, right?
I have a I have a different approach. I have a good synthesis through my own experiences and and kind of combining esoteric psychological spiritual teachings and bringing in the workable format to help people, right? And even this work with mastering spiritual warfare. This is has been I've been deeply interested, fascinated by these other forces, even more the dark side, right? As a warrior, and have I have a more warrior quality, even my astrological chart, Mars and Aries, and like there's a warrior quality,
Lian (25:56)
Hmm.
Bernhard Guenther (25:57)
Right? Even my name I didn't know. Bernhard Günther means brave warrior. You know, it does I had no idea from ancient Germanic, right? I had
Lian (26:02)
Dessert! Oh my goodness! I love that!
Bernhard Guenther (26:06)
no idea. Courage and bra you know what mean? So brave like a bear, right? So so the warrior thing came also to me, you know, it's that's an archetype in itself. And you're correct, not all
Lian (26:16)
Yeah.
Bernhard Guenther (26:17)
of us are doing this. Like I'm not expecting everybody to do what I don't. We are all warriors, you know. But I'm providing work who maybe called to the similar path, right?
Lian (26:26)
Hmm.
Bernhard Guenther (26:27)
even when you look in ancient India, they had different classes, the case system, which there's some truth. There's a warrior class, right? There's a householder class. There's the Bar Brahman class, more the academic, like, you know, wise you know, scholars and whatnot. So, you know, what's called Dharma. You have to that's about finding your Dharma, your soul signature, so to speak. Right. And
Lian (26:50)
Hmm.
Bernhard Guenther (26:51)
even in my work, like I've been deeply in through my own inexperiences also, head of was forced to understand the forces I'm confronted with engaging with, right? Even when I created this course, Mastering Spiritual Warfare of two, three years, I had this deep inner, it comes like an inner almost pressure. Like I need to bring a teaching for this. I have to put this in a format. This is necessary because the way I create things sometimes is also what I would like to see. I don't see this out there. Nobody's doing this. Like this is what I would love to learn. You know what I mean?
Similar when you make art and music, I think when I was making music, it's almost you do what you really love, enjoy doing. The moment you do something,
Lian (27:32)
Mmm.
Bernhard Guenther (27:33)
just what you think other people want to hear, you're already out of integrity. Right? That's what I see,
Lian (27:38)
Mm-hmm.
Bernhard Guenther (27:39)
especially nowadays with social media and and and almost all this influence on everybody's psychospiritual culture. And people jump on bandwagons and do more what other they become copies of other people and always only present what other people want.
Think they want to hear, right? It's almost a they lose their
Lian (27:56)
Hmm.
Bernhard Guenther (27:57)
own dharma, right? And even the Bhagavad Gita is one of the worst things you can do for your own development, is live somebody else's dharma, right? Somebody else's purpose. So it's about finding your own unique expression of that, right? And as my life story showed, it it's not just also just one thing. People are always looking for this one thing they think they need to do for the rest of your life. And sometimes, yeah, that's what God, the divine, intends for you to do.
But it's not always like this, right? It's even remember even Sriobindo talked about once you become an instrument for the divine, you don't even have an attachment to the work. It's more the consciousness you bring into it. And it can change at any time, right? I might be like with my wife, we love doing our podcast together. It's really feel drawn to it, you know. But who knows where we were drawn to or the life goes in a couple of years from now. So this whole idea of purpose is very fluid. It's not this particular thing. You don't want to grasp on it, right?
Lian (28:54)
Hmm.
Bernhard Guenther (28:56)
But really understanding the point of dharma, because dharma, you know, is basically the cosmic law. Every you have your own specific dharma, you know, your higher purpose for being here. And if I look back, I can see almost God's guidance through all my life, but I was not aware of it.
Right. I was always through my own doing, but now I can see like this invisible like hand. And the more you become aware of it through your inner work, then you more align your personal will with divine will, which wants to manifest uniquely through you. And then you become you take yourself out of the equation. And then life becomes a bit easier. You flow more with it without the resistance. Right. Even looking back when I did my drumming music and all of this, there was a really important part of my life.
Artistic expression. Everything would has its purpose, right? It prepared me even for my body work because there's about something about drumming and rhythm and getting into my body, expressing myself emotionally. It helped me to do a lot of shadow work through the music, actually, ironically, to express a lot of difficult emotions. And that led to the next, right? And and body work helped me to get into my own body and release a lot of stuff I stored within it. So everything is interrelated.
And you never know, you cannot connect the dots looking forward. You know, one of the great insights I got was actually from Steve Jobs. If you remember, he's the founder of Apple,
Lian (30:20)
Mm-hmm.
Bernhard Guenther (30:21)
right? And he gave this very profound speech at you know what they sometimes do at someone university, college, you know, for graduates. And he told told a story about how you can never
Connected dots looking forward, you know. But everything, whatever you may do, and what you feel drawn to passion in the moment has its purpose, maybe in the future, in a way you don't realise. So he was, you know, he's actually a college dropout, as you know, right? But he was went for a couple of years to college when he was very young, before he founded Apple. And he was very drawn to calligraphy, you know, calligraphy, like writing and all of that. He just was fascinated by it. So he took a couple of semester studying calligraphy and learning about it, right? Just because he was for the sake of passion about it, wanted to learn about it. And then later, years later, when he founded Apple, that laid the foundation as the first personal computer to offer different fonts. That's how fonts were created. He was the first to create fonts on a computer based on his passion of learning about calligraphy. So that's, you know, but you can only I can now Connect the dots looking back, like, there's this whole like path, everything had meaning, nothing was meaningless that led me to where I am right now, which I cannot possibly have thought about back then, 20 what some years ago, right? So the the lesson of this is also whatever you in the moment already feel drawn to, don't dismiss this. Listen to that. You know, even there's what you really fascinate in, you know, there's a deeper drive like.
Again, Joseph Campbell, that excites you. Follow your bliss. Follow that, right? Don't do, don't follow things like just, how can I make the most profit? How can I make money with this and that, right? That's already you're putting the card in front of the horse, right? There's a saying, f do what you love and the money will follow. It's kind of oversimplified saying, right? But ultimately, when you really hear what you're meant to do, and the ego doesn't hijack it and you go off the flow.
You'll be also provided for, right? So it's about coming into this higher alignment and and through the inner work, then naturally your personal will become more aligned with the higher will, right? So you don't identify anymore with, I am doing this. This is my work. This is like you're trying to get yourself more out of the way in order to become an instrument. And you're right, this is unique for everyone. So what I'm doing, I'm pretty very aware this is not what other people should be doing. You know, I'm very aware, even when I work with people.
My intention is like to help you find your path, right? And in your own your unique way, and become your own guide. You, you know, I don't want, don't you know, I don't want you to become dependent on me. I don't need followers. I want you to become the best version God intended it for you, right? So, and you're right, some people are more external, more warrior, they're more on the battlefield, right? Absolutely. Then other people may work more in the background, maybe, you know what I mean.
You know, even being a mother or a family, that's also the path of the householder. That's also beautiful, to especially nowadays, raising a child. This is a high level of responsibility and very important nowadays, anyway, and can be challenging, obviously, as you know. But that in itself, everything is a spiritual path. That's why I'm a big fan,
Lian (33:46)
Hmm.
Bernhard Guenther (33:46)
or fan is maybe very touched by the Bhagavad Gita, because the Bhagavad Gita teaches you it's not about Separating, this is my spiritual life and this is just my regular life. No, everything, as Sriobin said, all life is yoga. It's just with the level of consciousness you approach, everything is an offering to the divine. You become an instrument in no matter what you do. And I think the ego likes to hijack then thinking that purpose has to be something very important, something that you know, contributes to humanity, like as if they're different levels, you know. But I've seen people like when I go shopping at the grocery store and interact with the with the clerk, right? Like if he or she's embodied in a true essence, they also provide exactly where they need to be and help humanity, right? So we need to get out of this ego egotistical idea to give value to different work of what is better or
Lian (34:42)
Hmm.
Bernhard Guenther (34:42)
worse. You know what I mean? Because I recently had a had a plumber here installed some things in in our home. We need to get a new water boil and what like. And he's completely living his dharma. He loves what he's doing, right? He's like, I could never do it. And I can trust him. He's the best at what he's doing. He's constantly learning more. And this shows itself in the quality of the work. He's an instrument of the divine in his own work, right? He doesn't need to be on the internet talking about things like I do. So so it's about finding your unique way, right? In in your own unique Dharma.
So and and that's the most important part. People don't live without Dharma. And like the Gita said, one of the worst things can you can do is live somebody else's Dharma. How do you live somebody else's Dharma when you when you're very wounded, when you live what your parents wanted you to do, when you're very socially, culturally conditioned, what society tells you what brings happiness, when you compare yourself to others and then do what others do, then you lose yourself in your own dharma. So again,
Lian (35:39)
you
Bernhard Guenther (35:40)
you know
So the essence is Dharma is not just one specific thing, it's more an inner state of receptivity and then it manifests in whatever unique way based on your soul potential.
Lian (35:53)
Hmm. Beautiful set. Beautifully said, if I can say it. Um, synchronistically, I had a conversation with a friend this morning and he was a professionally trained musician. And then as sort of life took him, you know, as it does through all these other, um, versions of himself. And so he kind of works as a therapist and coach. Um, and was. sort of still doing music on the side. And then just in this last year has realized this, just as you were saying, you know, this idea of purpose rather than kind of what's really just moving through you and calling you. And he's been called deeply back to music and his intention is to record his first solo album this year.
And it was just, I could feel it as he was talking. Funny enough, he mentioned your wife because the song he was, he read the lyrics of the song he'd just written and it was about one of the themes was evolutionary astrology. And he mentioned your wife, funny enough, as someone had really inspired him with that topic. it just, everything you just said was so encapsulated in what he was sharing, not this grand sense of this is my purpose to be know, a musician or to impart spiritual truth through music. None of it, it was just, this is me doing what just is like breathing for him. And he was saying, you know, sometimes I don't
Bernhard Guenther (37:31)
Exactly. Right.
Lian (37:33)
even go to bed, I just lay on the sofa with my bass guitar next to me and then wake up and like grab it and start writing, you know, whatever's coming, come through me in the night. And such a great example of what you were talking about there where it isn't this, you know, heady ego idea of identity. It's just what we can just taste is wanting to come through. And of course, because of all the cultural ideas, yeah, it can be hard to
Bernhard Guenther (38:00)
Yeah, yeah.
Lian (38:02)
listen to.
Bernhard Guenther (38:03)
You know what it reminds me of. You have you heard of Alan Watts? Yes.
Lian (38:06)
Yes. Yeah. Yeah. I love Alan Watts.
Bernhard Guenther (38:08)
Alan Watts, he's beautiful, you know, it's a great philosopher. I was into him a lot. And he also has the great, you know, it's like it's like a being, it's like a flower cannot help but flowering. You know
Lian (38:20)
Mmm.
Bernhard Guenther (38:20)
what I mean? Like you missed, he cannot help just it just comes out. Like for me the same, like I'm in because that's like it just comes. That's who I am. It's not like I'm not pretending to be anybody. When I'm off camera, off like I'm starting, I'm reading, I'm talking about the same topics to my wife. I'm constantly, I cannot help it. I'm enjoyed. It's just constantly coming out of my being, right? So to speak. Right. I still have my persona as a teacher and like has a certain role to play, but this is who I am. It's not there's no pretense about it. This is just I cannot help but doing it. It comes naturally, like you describe of your friend. There's no even a true musician is like it just comes out of them naturally and they need to express it, right? And then once but once you try to control the process with the ego coming in and trying to identify with it, that's when the trouble comes in.
Lian (39:10)
Yeah, yeah. So changing gears slightly, something I've certainly witnessed and I imagine you have too, when, and I'm going to say this as if I'm talking about other people, it's not at all to say that, you know, I'm immune from this, but I have noticed certain people for whatever reason have a particular tendency to almost identify not as, but look at, say for example, dark forces externally and create an identity around this idea of I'm here to do battle with these external forces. Interestingly, what I've noticed a lot of the time that people who have that persona often have a lot of their own shadow, which is almost getting neglected because of the focus on this idea of this external darkness.
I wonder, know, firstly, why that might be the case that those who have that kind of strong sense, it may well be true that they are to care to do battle with that kind of external darkness, but it's interesting to me that often there is this, inner darkness in quote marks that there is going unattended as a result, but why they might have, seems to me perhaps more than the average person is interesting to me. So it's a little bit of a, kind of mixed bag that I've just named. But I would love to hear your sense of this, the way we can kind of almost be so focused externally, we're kind of neglecting what's here for us to do. But also whether you've seen there's particular, I guess, types of people, whether that's for whatever reason, more of a tendency.
Bernhard Guenther (41:16)
Yeah. So there are several things in my experience, since this topic has become more popular about external forces, people overly over identify, easily fall number one into victim blame trap. You
Lian (41:28)
Hmm.
Bernhard Guenther (41:29)
know, if you're still into victim and blame other forces, you get entrap yourself, you attract more of this, you fall in delusion, you fall a little into psychosis, paranoia, you know. Sorry, I had to say there's a lot of people who are hardcore identified as targeted individuals.
Lian (41:45)
Hmm
Bernhard Guenther (41:46)
deal with psychoparanoia on many levels and see things where there are no things. Of course, they would deny it and all of this. But then you're not as long as you're victim blame, you're not ready for this work. As long you don't take responsibility for everything and get out of this blame thing and you think you're a victim, you're not ready to be a spiritual warrior. Right. That's kind
Lian (42:04)
Mm-hmm.
Bernhard Guenther (42:05)
of in my even my course I talk about the the attributes. Even David Hawkins on his map of consciousness, he shows, I don't know if you're aware of it, very profound work.
He calibrated the levels of consciousness of humanity over 20 years and he showed on his map that 80% of humanity are caught in victim blame consciousness, trapped in falsehood. You know, only 20% arise above it when you can really reach higher levels of consciousness. So you have to already get out of pride. Pride is like the ego still feels like, I'm a tar you know, I'm so important, I'm getting attacked and all of this. That's all the ego coming in, right?
So there's many issues. So, number one, externalizing, and also people not sincerely engage in foundational psychological inner work. Even Rudolf Steiner over 100 years talked about it. So important to gain self-knowledge to understand. Even he called talked about the inner shadow, your inner parts. So you don't mistake those parts for alien entities. Right?
Lian (43:03)
Mm-hmm.
Bernhard Guenther (43:04)
Don't mistake your own traumatised inner child, suppressed inner child, shadow part, whatever it is, for an entity, which many people do. You know, I've lost count how many emails I've gotten over the years randomly. I'm attacked by thirteen entities. I have twenty-three entity attachments and this and that. Now first you have to be a very high level of consciousness in being to be able to perceive that, right? And not make the assumption. That's why when you see in all their Zatic teachings, even the great occultist Dion Fortune in her c occult classic psychic self-defense from over hundred years ago. Talked about don't make assumptions, right? You have to rule everything as out. She made even
Lian (43:44)
Mmm.
Bernhard Guenther (43:46)
fun about somebody thought he was dealing with the demonic entity attachments, and then he just gave her some medicine, like you know, you know, and he was just dealing with constipation and has to just take a good dump and then he felt better basically. Like literally she cracked that joke. Like that's what's happening. You know what mean? You have to really
Lian (44:03)
you
Bernhard Guenther (44:06)
rule everything out on a physical level, on a psychological level, right? before jumping into this entity because people make assumptions
Lian (44:13)
Mmm.
Bernhard Guenther (44:14)
left and right. I've worked with many people over the years who assumed or thought it was an entity when it in the end was just their very fragmented, repressed, cast out, abandoned inner child, which can also be very aggressive, very hostile because it's been so shunned in in in all of this, right?
Lian (44:31)
Mmm.
Bernhard Guenther (44:32)
So you need to be able to differentiate. And that requires really sincere psychological inner work to do that, right? Otherwise people take this identity on this identity. And also, even though I use the word spiritual world battle, but it's not like even Thomas Meyer talked about this. He's a great man. I had an on my podcast. He is a clairvoyant. He is also aware of this forces. He wrote the book, the covet vex the spiritual consequences of the covet vaccine, right? On on on the soul spirit in life after death. So he's aware very aware of the Aramonic forces and black magic and He worked with the dead as well, helping their transition. But he always says, like, it's not a you you gotta get out of this mindset. It's not like a Hollywood movie, like you have a sword, and if you're sword of light, you're gonna kill the demonic being. It doesn't work like this. You know, even these forces is not, you don't come in with anger and all of this, right? They have their own evolutionary purpose. Some can even be transmuted, right? And even I'm gonna actually great question, point you make, because even in my work,
It's not that I'm looking constantly for attack and other forces always, and here I'm waiting with my sword in battle. I am actually focused more on the sunlit path as Sri Obindavakov. I'm more focused on divine forces, on offering myself to the divine, praying in a very positive, grounded way. but I have also awareness and knowledge in case something else comes in to be able to deal with that. And that's what I'm teaching. There's
Lian (46:00)
Hmm.
Bernhard Guenther (46:01)
a lot of people not aware. It's not like I'm over. People think I'm so negative sometimes and focus on negativity and evil and forces. No, I like to get this analogy. You know, if you don't know anything about traffic, right, and you cross a road and you, you know, and you are not aware of it, you get killed by a car, right? but you need to understand the traffic laws. So you learn the traffic laws, learn how to drive a car so you become more secure. Run once you understand the rules of the games.
And you cross a road or something, you're not in paranoia every day, living like, my God, a car is going to come here and there. You know how it flows. You drive a car, you know the rules, you you know, you're not always in fear and paranoia that they get hit by a car. Same with understanding once you under understand of these forces, certain experience, understand the cult laws, the rules of the game, you're not looking for attack everywhere, right?
You're just gonna deal, you're more discerning when it comes, you kind of can spot it, similar in traffic. there's a dangerous situation. I need to like kind of be aware now. But you're not constantly looking for it, right? So this is very the big difference. And that's even what I teach in spiritual warfare. It's more like under giving people the knowledge, understanding they didn't get anywhere else because, like I mentioned before, it has been suppressed, ignored, or people just avoid it because of misconceptions. But as I said, any complete spiritual esoteric teaching shows you also not only the way out. But the interference is the traps and the r and the forces that want to distract you or entrap you. But it doesn't mean to focus on that. Right? Even Sriobindo
Lian (47:35)
Mmm.
Bernhard Guenther (47:36)
talked about this overly I see this as well. The overfocus on on hostile forces can also attract them, the paranoia. That's the almost the irony and the paradox, right? But then people say,
Lian (47:44)
I was just about to ask you that. Yes.
Bernhard Guenther (47:49)
Well, why should I learn about them i if if I may attract them? Well, ignorance is also no defense, then you're more vulnerable either. The point is having more
Lian (47:56)
Mmm.
Bernhard Guenther (47:57)
an adult grounded approach. You learn about it, you understand it, you spot it, but you don't get overfixated on it all the time. You don't get identified. You know, I'm not running around, I'm here a spiritual warrior with my sword or just waiting. Come on, get me, you know, like in a Hollywood movie. It's not like that. You know? It's like now I feel actually more able to give myself to experience more positive emotions, positive experiences, and true divine spiritual alignment, more secured in my true being, because I have a certain I know I can deal with whatever may come, so to speak. And I still learn my lessons. I'm not enlightened by any stretch of the imagination, right? But it's more understanding reality and these forces. Same with shadow work. People don't understand. It's not about looking for your shadow and digging in your shadow. That's not how a shadow work works. Always, you know, you just work with your triggers as they come. The shadow reveals itself in everyday life, but you're not trying to dig, you're not trying to look for your shadow. That's a wrong approach. That's also a misunderstanding of Jung and shadow work. So that's the point. So people who get stuck, they they have almost a different approach to they get very identified to the label again, you know, spiritual warrior. You don't want to you want to play an archetype. So the warrior is an archetype, like as in Carl Jung's work.
And you play certain roles, you play the archetype. I definitely have the archetype of the spiritual warrior. This is part of my path. But as Carl Jung said, it gets very the the trap is set when you identify with the archetype. That's when
Lian (49:30)
Mmm.
Bernhard Guenther (49:31)
you fall into grandiosity, that's when the superego comes in, that's when the loose fake temptation, I'm a spiritual warrior, and all of this, right? No, you play the archetype, but this is not who you are, right? Even like in everyday life, like your mother, you have the mother archetype. You need to play that role for your children, absolutely. But this is not who you are.
Lian (49:54)
Hmm.
Bernhard Guenther (49:54)
Right? So we play all these different archetypes and and we should play them well, but not identifying with them. That's the key issue.
Lian (50:04)
Yeah, yeah, beautifully said. We are up on time, believe it or not. It's flown by.
Bernhard Guenther (50:11)
Okay.
Lian (50:12)
Is there anything that we've not touched on that feels an important thing to say in completion?
Bernhard Guenther (50:23)
No, I think that was good. I mean, for the amount of time we have, we touched on some important things. That was a great question at the end. I think it's important to put the spiritual warrior thing into context that it's not always this battle you're constantly fighting. It's more having an awareness and understanding that helps you actually engage in life more positively in on a higher level. I mean it's a big topic. There's always anything we can dive into, right? So
Lian (50:51)
could easily end up with a whole part three. But yes, I feel as though this has been at least a kind of dipping our toe back in, in a way that does bring it to the individual that I've really, really enjoyed exploring with you. So where can listeners find out more about you and your work? I know that you've just, as time of recording, just begun of course and this probably will be going out around September where I'm guessing you've got something else coming up so where can listeners find out more about that.
Bernhard Guenther (51:25)
Yeah, so if anybody's w more interested in the specific work about spiritual warfare, I have a program called Mastering Spiritual Warfare. It's a ten week in-depth program. So we were just filled up the third round. It's only available for 40 people. I don't do more. It's you know, and it's by application and only as well. But you can hurry here look more for it at the website mastering spiritual warfare dot com. All the information is on there, everything you need to know. But the bunch of my work, all the free content is available on my website, veilofreality.com. Hundreds of articles written about for over two decades. There's videos as well. some documentaries I've made, videos about these topics. Also the podcast I host with my wife, the Cosmic Matrix Podcast. You can find it out there, also on obviously Apple or Spotify. And but yeah, Vale of Reality.com is the hub for all of my work and also links to socials. No that
Lian (52:25)
Fantastic. Well, thank you so much for coming back on Bernhard. This is, yeah, I feel like a really beautiful part two to our first episode. Thank you so much. And
Bernhard Guenther (52:36)
Beautiful. Thank you, Lian.
Lian (52:38)
thank you for being the spiritual warrior that you are. We do need people like you doing what you're doing.
Bernhard Guenther (52:40)
Thank you. Awesome.
Lian (52:47)
What a wonderful conversation. Here are three things that stayed with me. That pull to feel chosen, special, or already awake can be one of the most dangerous traps on the spiritual path. And it appeals to the wounded ego and can leave a person believing they've arrived when actually they've fallen further into illusion, quite tricky to recognise in ourselves, which is often why it's helpful to have teachers' guides who can reflect this to us. Telling a wounded inner part from something that has come in from outside begins with sincere work and ruling out the physical and psychological first, since an abandoned inner child can be hostile enough to be mistaken for an entity.
Focusing on dark forces can draw them closer, and yet ignorance of them offers no protection either. Much like learning the rules of the road, understanding how these forces work allows a person to spot them when they appear and otherwise get on with life, grounded and orientated towards the divine.
If this conversation has stirred something that you want to follow deeper, that's exactly what Junio Guidance Circle is for. UNIO is our fellowship for Wild Sovereign Souls. And as I said earlier, twice each month, Jonathan and I meet with UNIO members to meet you in whatever is challenging, calling you, or both, and to meet you exactly where you are and to help you move forward. The link for that is WildSovereinsoul.com.
And the show notes and the links are at wild sovereign soul.com slash podcast slash five six six. If you don't want to miss out on next week's episode, and we have got lots of absolute caucus coming up, follow or subscribe wherever you're listening. Until then, I'm sending you all my love and blessings as you walk your wild sovereign soul path.